Circuit Training / Right Volume?

J9R4W

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Hi all, just been looking into EMOM, I've found a few good formats to try out.

What I was wondering, for specifically boosting my reps in the gym test, should I do an EMOM workout with press-up, pull-up and sit-ups all done on the minuet? Or would it be better to a 30min workout and do e.g., 10mins of press-up, then 10mins of pull-up etc.,? I noticed in Sean Lerwills guide I got recently that one method of improving press-ups is EMOM only with press-ups and resting during the rest of the minuet. What would be best? Thanks.
 

thirdtry

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Hi all, just been looking into EMOM, I've found a few good formats to try out.

What I was wondering, for specifically boosting my reps in the gym test, should I do an EMOM workout with press-up, pull-up and sit-ups all done on the minuet? Or would it be better to a 30min workout and do e.g., 10mins of press-up, then 10mins of pull-up etc.,? I noticed in Sean Lerwills guide I got recently that one method of improving press-ups is EMOM only with press-ups and resting during the rest of the minuet. What would be best? Thanks.

Honestly there's no "best" here. Our bodies develop more and thrive off change, keeping it mixed up. Rather than doing just one or the other, keep mixing it up. Some days do all 3, some days do just the one at a time.
 

J9R4W

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Cool that makes sense, I'll try out different variations throughout the week. Cheers.
 

B11

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Hi all, just been looking into EMOM, I've found a few good formats to try out.

What I was wondering, for specifically boosting my reps in the gym test, should I do an EMOM workout with press-up, pull-up and sit-ups all done on the minuet? Or would it be better to a 30min workout and do e.g., 10mins of press-up, then 10mins of pull-up etc.,? I noticed in Sean Lerwills guide I got recently that one method of improving press-ups is EMOM only with press-ups and resting during the rest of the minuet. What would be best? Thanks.
If you want to get more volume in then the same exercise on the minute will do that, if it’s more conditioning then all of them within the minute would work on that, don’t know if you’ve seen the Sean lerwill gainers, I’ve started doing it with pull ups recently to see how well it works
 

J9R4W

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@B11 Okay cheers, so if going for volume on one day, would you recommend, for instance, doing different exercises as EMOM at different times during the day? Or alternatively, because I'm only really needing to get press-ups sorted, do an AM circuit w/out press-ups them do press-ups as EMOM in the PM? I could experiment to see what works to be fair.

Yeah I have tried gainers, I saw them on YT and that's what I've been basing my circuits on, and adding a couple of reps each week.
 

B11

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@B11 Okay cheers, so if going for volume on one day, would you recommend, for instance, doing different exercises as EMOM at different times during the day? Or alternatively, because I'm only really needing to get press-ups sorted, do an AM circuit w/out press-ups them do press-ups as EMOM in the PM? I could experiment to see what works to be fair.

Yeah I have tried gainers, I saw them on YT and that's what I've been basing my circuits on, and adding a couple of reps each week.
What sort of numbers are you hitting on the press ups? Yeah if that’s what you’re struggling with I would do them separately or extra at least 2-3 times a week. I found the best way for getting up to 60 plus was building up reps by specifically working on them as well as getting them in circuits I was doing
 

J9R4W

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What sort of numbers are you hitting on the press ups? Yeah if that’s what you’re struggling with I would do them separately or extra at least 2-3 times a week. I found the best way for getting up to 60 plus was building up reps by specifically working on them as well as getting them in circuits I was doing
Cool cheers, I think I'll do something like that then.

My current scores are Press-ups 33, Pull-up 11/12 Sit-up 85. I do know I've got some kind of pushing weakness that needs sorting, as I have picked niggles in my elbows from overdoing press-ups or doing too much too soon. Certainly some work to do there.
 

B11

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Cool cheers, I think I'll do something like that then.

My current scores are Press-ups 33, Pull-up 11/12 Sit-up 85. I do know I've got some kind of pushing weakness that needs sorting, as I have picked niggles in my elbows from overdoing press-ups or doing too much too soon. Certainly some work to do there.
No worries mate, pull ups and sit up numbers are good, yeah definitely build it up over a few weeks and you’ll get that number up
 

J9R4W

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No worries mate, pull ups and sit up numbers are good, yeah definitely build it up over a few weeks and you’ll get that number up
Thanks, I'll definitely give what you said a go with doing EMOM press-ups on top of, or as separate from, normal circuits. As an extra, what do think about about weighted-vest press-ups or other weighted work i.e., bench press for boosting reps? Or is that sort of stuff more for conditioning?
 

Biggles

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I'd say minimum of 2 with rest between them.

I see in your original post you mention something about running counting as your 'leg day'. There's absolutely zero reason to do that, all the sports science out there says you can train legs and run pretty consistently without overworking as long as your nutrition and rest is OK, and obviously you build up to it from whatever your current fitness level is. I have zero issues doing 6 days running per week and 4 full body circuits session per week currently, of which 3 are High Intensity and 1 is a deliberate and controlled strength session.

A good YouTuber to check out is Nick Bare. Former US Army officer now a full-time fitness guru that has set out to prove you can be strong and good at running simultaneously. He will do marathon training in the AM and bodybuilding or power lifting in the PM and has never been injured or over trained so far.

Ross Edgley's "World's Fittest Book" also discusses how to balance running and strength training. He notes that it's best not to do sprints on the same day as intense leg sessions (e.g. don't do hill sprints in the AM and heavy Squats in the PM) but you very safely can do your steady state runs on the same day as your heavy leg sessions because you're working completely different muscle fibres and physiological pathways.

I'd actually argue it's quite hard to over train but quite easy to under-recover, if that makes sense. I.e. your body can do a lot more than you think as long as you plan your phys timetable efficiently and eat/sleep enough.
Second this Nick Bare is a beast.
 

mace

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Massive fan of Nick Bare myself but I would honestly be extremely surprised if he wasn’t on any gear!
Worth watching Greg Doucette’s video on him, if you can tolerate his voice :D
 

Mattys

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Worth watching Greg Doucette’s video on him, if you can tolerate his voice :D

haha yeah seen it mate as irritating but entertaining as they come
 

mace

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On the push up front let me chip in as well what I would do:
3 separate workouts. Depending on your recovery either 1 or 2 days between the push up session.

Workout 1: gainers to the beep (see above, 3 sets, every session you add 1 rep): this one takes care of specificity and a tried and proven way to improve your reps.

Workout 2: eccentric push ups (you need to have someone to help you): place something heavy 5-10kg to begin with on your back, go down as slow as possible -eccentric phase, triceps lengthens under load and is capable of handling more load-, at the bottom position have someone to remove the weight off your back so you can press yourself up -concentric phase, triceps shorten, you can’t handle more weight in a concentric phase than in eccentric- quickly, place the weight back -in the front support position make sure you are holding a “hollow position” and throughout the whole reps- and next rep. Eccentric training is a fantastic way of building strength and strengthening the connective tissue. Try 3-4 sets of 4-6 reps with at least 4 seconds of lowering, ideally 6 seconds. It’s strength training, low reps, low sets. Don’t go to failure with this one. Clean reps, good form.


Workout 3: greasing the groove. This one will take care of building up overall volume without overworking. Start by figuring out your max reps (let’s say 20). Now take 50% of that (10). Start with 10 sets (you can add an extra set per workout if you can do them all nice and clean). You do a set of 10 push ups (or whatever your 50% is). Then you are going to have a minimum of 15 minutes of rest. 20 minutes is even better. After the rest you do your next set of 10 push ups. And again 15-20 minutes of rest and repeat. You continue with this until you feel fresh. You don’t go nowhere near to failure. This one takes a big ego check to control ourselves and a lot of free time. As you progress you can easily do 600-700 push ups in a day without feeling tired.

+1 tip: learn the “Turkish get up (TGU)” (Mark Wildman on YT breaks it down really well). Even if you don’t own a kettlebell/dumbbell you can learn the movement and practice with a water bottle. This exercise will help you to move better, activate your core but most importantly work your shoulder in all angles. With the push ups you are only working in a so called “sagittal plane”. If that’s the only “angle” you are working the shoulder joint it won’t develop well and you are going to be weaker in other directions and more prone to injuries. Also as you are holding a weight overhead with locked elbows you are working on isometric contractions of the triceps so now you have all 3 muscle contractions covered for this muscle. Added bonus it that you can use the TGU for a warm up for all your training sessions.

Notice that you never go to failure. Some will jump on it and say: that won’t train you mentally and won’t fatigue you enough. Bullsh1t. Your goal right now is to get quality training sessions in to increase your max reps and train for longevity. There will be a place and time for doing 3 sets to failure but this is not it.
 

mrar32

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Nick Bare is 100% juicing. Maintaining that amount of muscle mass/body fat when you're an endurance athlete is not possible naturally. Most fitness youtubers are sted heads to be fair.


Honestly there's no "best" here. Our bodies develop more and thrive off change, keeping it mixed up. Rather than doing just one or the other, keep mixing it up. Some days do all 3, some days do just the one at a time.
Also, I second this. Your body will get used to a repetitive programme pretty quick. Mix it up and aim to progressively overload in order to develop. Then every other week, test your max reps to the bleep.
 

J9R4W

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On the push up front let me chip in as well what I would do:
3 separate workouts. Depending on your recovery either 1 or 2 days between the push up session.

Workout 1: gainers to the beep (see above, 3 sets, every session you add 1 rep): this one takes care of specificity and a tried and proven way to improve your reps.

Workout 2: eccentric push ups (you need to have someone to help you): place something heavy 5-10kg to begin with on your back, go down as slow as possible -eccentric phase, triceps lengthens under load and is capable of handling more load-, at the bottom position have someone to remove the weight off your back so you can press yourself up -concentric phase, triceps shorten, you can’t handle more weight in a concentric phase than in eccentric- quickly, place the weight back -in the front support position make sure you are holding a “hollow position” and throughout the whole reps- and next rep. Eccentric training is a fantastic way of building strength and strengthening the connective tissue. Try 3-4 sets of 4-6 reps with at least 4 seconds of lowering, ideally 6 seconds. It’s strength training, low reps, low sets. Don’t go to failure with this one. Clean reps, good form.


Workout 3: greasing the groove. This one will take care of building up overall volume without overworking. Start by figuring out your max reps (let’s say 20). Now take 50% of that (10). Start with 10 sets (you can add an extra set per workout if you can do them all nice and clean). You do a set of 10 push ups (or whatever your 50% is). Then you are going to have a minimum of 15 minutes of rest. 20 minutes is even better. After the rest you do your next set of 10 push ups. And again 15-20 minutes of rest and repeat. You continue with this until you feel fresh. You don’t go nowhere near to failure. This one takes a big ego check to control ourselves and a lot of free time. As you progress you can easily do 600-700 push ups in a day without feeling tired.

+1 tip: learn the “Turkish get up (TGU)” (Mark Wildman on YT breaks it down really well). Even if you don’t own a kettlebell/dumbbell you can learn the movement and practice with a water bottle. This exercise will help you to move better, activate your core but most importantly work your shoulder in all angles. With the push ups you are only working in a so called “sagittal plane”. If that’s the only “angle” you are working the shoulder joint it won’t develop well and you are going to be weaker in other directions and more prone to injuries. Also as you are holding a weight overhead with locked elbows you are working on isometric contractions of the triceps so now you have all 3 muscle contractions covered for this muscle. Added bonus it that you can use the TGU for a warm up for all your training sessions.

Notice that you never go to failure. Some will jump on it and say: that won’t train you mentally and won’t fatigue you enough. Bullsh1t. Your goal right now is to get quality training sessions in to increase your max reps and train for longevity. There will be a place and time for doing 3 sets to failure but this is not it.
Cheers for the info there, those sound like really good strategies to try out. Much appreciated!
 

thirdtry

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Nick Bare is 100% juicing. Maintaining that amount of muscle mass/body fat when you're an endurance athlete is not possible naturally. Most fitness youtubers are sted heads to be fair.

I agree on most fitness YouTubers etc. I know he does a lot of stuff in collaboration with Lympstone but Ross Edgley is 10000% juicing, the bloke is built better than many competitive bodybuilders despite somehow being an endurance machine.

However, I don't reckon Nick Bare is. I carry a similar amount of mass and would consider myself a mid-level endurance runner (33-38 miles per week). I follow a similar split of long runs mixed with strength & conditioning. Only difference is his mileage is a little higher (I believe he's at about 40-45mpw average) and his body fat is considerably lower. Considering he's managed to maintain a proper lifting program while most of us in the UK haven't then I'd say that body shape and performance is possible naturally if you have several years of conditioning and adaptation behind you. Plus he doesn't show any signs of steroid belly.

I imagine I'll revert to the typical "Nod Bod" in Training (fat belly, huge forearms and chest, skinny legs and arms) but current physique is a result of similar training plus Creatine and BCAAs as the main supplements.
 

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Slightly off topic but is it worth putting on a bit of mass muscle and fat before training for strength and insulation or is it better to just minimise muscle gain and just focus on strength and cv fitness, I am a bit torn as I am about 83 ish kg with very not a huge amount of body fat and around a 20 min 5k and coming up on a 140kg back squat which is my focus for the moment. I am probably about 5 months from beginning my application, any advice much appreciated!
 

mrar32

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However, I don't reckon Nick Bare is. I carry a similar amount of mass and would consider myself a mid-level endurance runner (33-38 miles per week). I follow a similar split of long runs mixed with strength & conditioning. Only difference is his mileage is a little higher (I believe he's at about 40-45mpw average) and his body fat is considerably lower. Considering he's managed to maintain a proper lifting program while most of us in the UK haven't then I'd say that body shape and performance is possible naturally if you have several years of conditioning and adaptation behind you. Plus he doesn't show any signs of steroid belly.
Mate that's a good argument to be fair, perhaps I'm overtly cynical because of how rampant steroid use actually is.

But I'd say I'm in a similar boat to you, as I've got a rugby background I'm carrying quite a bit of muscle. This is great *text deleted* i can yomp a house and I feel robust, but I am trying to shred down a bit, feel I'm going to need it just to get a bit more agile and speedy mate. Also I don't *text deleted* look like a wannabe fitness model in Lympstone, feel id deserve to get a few thrashings from the training team. Give me a *text deleted* rig for 8 months then i'll build it back once im in unit haha
 

mrar32

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Slightly off topic but is it worth putting on a bit of mass muscle and fat before training for strength and insulation or is it better to just minimise muscle gain and just focus on strength and cv fitness, I am a bit torn as I am about 83 ish kg with very not a huge amount of body fat and around a 20 min 5k and coming up on a 140kg back squat which is my focus for the moment. I am probably about 5 months from beginning my application, any advice much appreciated!
Very similar stats to me mate. I'm unsure myself. I feel i could take a whole minute off my 5k time if i lost a couple of kgs, so i'm *text deleted* give it a crack. with back squats etc i reckon theres definitely a point of diminishing returns, so if you could maintain a 140 squat whilst simultaneously getting faster you'll be smashing it. Just my opinion though.
 
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