Daily Mail Story on Women in Training

Discussion in 'Military News and Clips' started by GreyWing, Jan 1, 2017.

  1. Illustrious

    Illustrious Royal Marines Commando - Moderator

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    Cockney Joe. Arrived and took the unit for a bit. Gave a gypsy warning that if anyone came in after him, remedial phys was on the cards. Then proceeded to explain how he ran 1.5 miles in 7 minutes. Oh and because he is over 40 he gets a 2 minute head start.
     
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  2. wellmemedmyboy

    wellmemedmyboy Member

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    I suppose the RM and other reg's will just make their own rules at unit ie must still be under 10 mins? This is quite odd
     
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  3. wellmemedmyboy

    wellmemedmyboy Member

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    *text deleted* 11.30 should be cutoff for all inf let alone the 12.30 at the moment. Surely with the cutoff for Paras at 9.40/9.30 the RM cannot be at 11.30? This would mean in theory the cutoff for RM is higher than 131 Cdo who are Army reserve who ask for under 9.30 run time mandatory... seems weird!
     
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  4. Caversham

    Caversham Former RM Commando

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    That's the guy! Many dits around about his career!

    Alan
     
  5. Xerath

    Xerath Well-Known Member

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    Cut off for Inf is 12:30 on selection but during training you need to get under 10:30 to pass your BFT.
     
  6. candybuddy

    candybuddy New Member

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    The army including the paras on selection only do 1.5 mile compared to the 3 mile BFT the RM do. Then once there at unit the run time goes down to 10:30 for males.

    Although it does seem a waste of time allowing people to pass selection that may not cut it later on, but then the army have larger recruitment numbers to fill.
     
  7. Illustrious

    Illustrious Royal Marines Commando - Moderator

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    Isn't there just! Dits galore of him taunting local IRA players in NI.

    We once offered him £6000 to shave his moustache off. I felt bad for the lad he chose to give his answer to. I don't think I've ever seen a lad disappear inside himself so quickly.
     
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  8. Chelonian

    Chelonian Well-Known Member

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    As an aside, RSMs often had a reputation for being a bit unhinged back in the day.

    One particular RSM at Depot Para in the 1970s allegedly insisted that a bicycle be arrested and jailed for the crime of leaning against the wall of 'his' drill shed, although I've heard a similar tale attributed to others over the years.
     
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  9. arny01

    arny01 Ex Pongo.

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    Definitely unhinged!! Ours locked up the whole Regiment after a muster parade, including the regimental goat!! He then proceed to "bust" the goat for curling one off on the drill square!! If you ask me, it was all an act?? The role all my former RSMS went into after their time was "Families officer!!" where youd see them walking round camp greeting everyone with a smile and a wave!! Whereas the previous week as the Razman you'd more likely find yourself locked up for slovenly behaviour diffy a set of eyeballs!!
     
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  10. Chelonian

    Chelonian Well-Known Member

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    With hindsight, I agree. Another anecdote I can recall included a very public, ranting tirade directed at his own pace stick because it had a loose hinge. :)
     
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  11. ThreadpigeonsAlpha

    ThreadpigeonsAlpha Royal Marines Commando

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    Wait, what?!
     
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  12. ThreadpigeonsAlpha

    ThreadpigeonsAlpha Royal Marines Commando

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    That will be that equality thing everyone keeps banging on about?

    Do they get the same pay though?
     
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  13. cc1

    cc1 Royal Marines Commando

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    INF 1.5mile is done in shorts & trainers after a 500m warm-up. RM BFT 1.5mile is done in combats & boots after a 1.5mile warm up. Regards to Para Reg... Different horses for courses. You'll probably find that Para fitness requirements require a higher level of cardiovascular endurance than RM, but most RM's are generally about 10kgs heavier and can man-pack a small house, indefinitely.

    Reg hit their line-of-departure slap-bang in a killing area and then pop smoke & straight up the middle out of it at full kill speed. Royal is expeditionary.
     
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    Last edited: Jan 5, 2017
  14. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Careers Adviser

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    With regard the PRMC criteria elements of selection, it's a topic I touched on, on our PRMC Forum page on Facebook yesterday.

    To re-iterate, the pass/fail elements of PRMC have become increasingly more stringent over the last decade in the reasonable assumption that the fitter the individual from the outset, the better the chance of success in recruit training. In other words PRMC has got progressively more difficult to pass - to the extent we're seeing former Week 26 recruits who opted out, fail PRMC upon re-applying. It's accepted some may forget the level of fitness required, but there are other factors which may indicate that a high score on PRMC automatically means a higher pass rate. It does to an extent, but after a certain level it doesn't.

    A while back we ran a trial, loading one troop with grade 'A' PRMC passes and another with grade 'B' passes.

    The results were unexpected. For starters the grade 'A' troop were found to be significantly younger on average and were also significantly lighter. They also had a significantly higher fail rate in training! The conclusions drawn were that the mental maturity and natural physical development of the 'B' Troop made them more resilient overall and less likely to quit.

    Before you ask, the troops remain unaware this trial was conducted and it was a few years ago.

    Spin forward to today and the throughput of applicants and those passing PRMC left a very high wastage rate but the pass/fail rate during Recruit Training has not improved significantly over the last decade. It is emphasised Recruit Training has remained pretty much unchanged and unlikely to be changed. PRMC is not training, it is an aid to selection for training.

    Today we are once again struggling to fill recruit troops. The time has come for a recalibration. PRMC constantly evolves. This has nothing to do with gender, there was a time when there was no selection course, although the timing of the readjustment of the criteria elements will leave many to naturally conclude 2+2=5.

    As an aside, it is generally felt that females passing PRMC, due to their natural height/weight, will probably find issues more similar to the group 'A' Troop during training.
     
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  15. blacky

    blacky Member

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    @Ninja_Stoker

    Is this correct then that the run times and bleep test minimum has been reduced?

    I understand you're saying that it's not due to women but I didn't see clarification if the minimums have been reduced.
     
  16. arny01

    arny01 Ex Pongo.

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    If success during RT hasn't been affected by increasing the physical standards during a pre selection, then it makes sense to adjust the pre selection standards to allow Recuit troops to filled as required? Your then looking at the system to bring lads up to the required standard. Someone who maybe hadn't put in the training to get a sub 9 min BFT, may well be perfectly capable of acheiving that with good physical training. At the end of the day it's supply and demand.
     
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  17. Caversham

    Caversham Former RM Commando

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    Summed it up nicely!

    Alan
     
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  18. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Careers Adviser

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    Applicants are being permitted to continue PRMC within wider criteria element pass/fail criteria, but the all-up score required to pass PRMC, when viewed in the round, remains unchanged.

    In other words you are not automatically binned off course if you are just outside the BFT run time or minimum VO2 Max level achieved but the downside is you could then complete PRMC only to find you've failed because you did not reach a total minimum score. It allows more latitude but equally anyone going on PRMC knowing they fall short of the required standards in any discipline is pretty much wasting their time getting on the train.
     
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  19. Rover

    Rover Moderator

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    Whilst over the 'Pond'........



    First women US marines in history join infantry as military pushes towards gender equality


    By: The Associated Press, January 5, 2017

    (

    CAMP LEJEUNE, N.C. — Three enlisted female Marines are reporting to a ground combat unit in North Carolina and are among the first women in the service to do so.

    1st Lt. John McCombs, a Marine Corps spokesman with the Second Marine Expeditionary Force at Camp Lejeune, says the three report Thursday to the 1st Battalion, 8th Marine Regiment. McCombs says the unit has three female officers that will assist them.


    The Marines are declining to identify the enlisted women. Armistead says they will serve as a rifleman, a machine gunner and a mortar Marine. There are some 40,000 Marines in the Expeditionary Force.

    In June, The Associated Press reported the Marine Corps had seven female officers either serving in combat posts or waiting in line to serve, and 167 women with non-combat jobs in front-line units.


    https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/articles/3-female-enlisted-marines-reporting-for-infantry-duty


    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...ter-camp-lejeune-north-carolina-a7512236.html
     
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  20. Saz

    Saz Well-Known Member

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    am i being thick - don't answer that one

    where is all the money coming from for this? i am assuming that lots of changes will need to be made to ctc to accommodate women recruits and for what gain, so a few can go through training and then when all the fuss dies down the numbers dwindle to zero

    sorry if this has been on another thread i am late to the party as i honestly thought that female RMs would never happen
     
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