Meghan & Harry Interview w/ Oprah

1919

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Somebody born with ginger hair is fair game for mockery, bullying and discrimination then?

Historical struggles with equality can be claimed by many groups. The foundation of ethnic equality law (not to mention common civility and decency) is that none of us can choose our genetic heritage and we should not be discriminated against because of that. Quite right too. But as a society we are quite fickle about what aspects of genetic heritage we acknowledge.

It's just culture that decides. Humans as rational beings is an illusion. This year's made that clear.

There's no reason why in the future picking on gingers might be seen as 100 x worse than doing it with skin colour. Or we might even see slavery as a good again - the ancients thought it was right and just that conflict should decide who should perform the necessary indentured servitude required to build a society. (We just outsource the guilt of that now onto regimes that don't care, but we're still happy to trade with and build alliances with). What is right and wrong, and seen to be, just depends on who controls the narrative.
 

Vine

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Somebody born with ginger hair is fair game for mockery, bullying and discrimination then?

Historical struggles with equality can be claimed by many groups. The foundation of ethnic equality law (not to mention common civility and decency) is that none of us can choose our genetic heritage and we should not be discriminated against because of that. Quite right too. But as a society we are quite fickle about what aspects of genetic heritage we acknowledge.
That’s not what I’m getting at really. I’m not saying ooh bullying gingers in fine but saying against some one of colour isn’t. The point I’m getting at is there hardly comparable and we can break it down all day about who’s had the worse time over history but if that was you in her situation, already seen as a outsider because of race for that to be said about your child would personally get my back up. I’d go as far as say if I had met someone of colour and she was pregnant and my family started banding that about I’d have more than a few words to say.
 

Chelonian

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I’d go as far as say if I had met someone of colour and she was pregnant and my family started banding that about I’d have more than a few words to say.
Well, that's your position and of course you are entitled to it.

As an aside, my old ma was born in India and lived the first twenty years of her life in Central Province. She recalls that it was quite common for family and friends to speculate about the skin tone of a child before birth, particularly if one partner was more dark skinned than the other. My ma can't recall that offence was taken. Quite the opposite actually; the community would be genuinely interested and supportive.
 

Vine

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Well, that's your position and of course you are entitled to it.

As an aside, my old ma was born in India and lived the first twenty years of her life in Central Province. She recalls that it was quite common for family and friends to speculate about the skin tone of a child before birth, particularly if one partner was more dark skinned than the other. My ma can't recall that offence was taken. Quite the opposite actually; the community would be genuinely interested and supportive.
That again is just in a totally different context and a long time ago. What was ok then isn’t now some things I’ll agree are just lefty nonsense but the progress we have made in that time in regards things like gay rights ending segregation etc etc has been the right direction. Yeah we can all change our minds and what we believe now probably won’t be ok in the next 50-100 years but I can definitely see how in his/her situation at the present time and circumstance would cause waves.
 

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What was ok then isn’t now...
Yep, it was the 1940s but the context is crucial. The interest shown in the unborn child's skin tone was a loving one and a discussion in which the child's parents actively engaged in. But that's just my ma speaking 'her truth' based upon her 'lived experience'.

As an aside, my own encounter with something similar occurred in east Africa in the 1980s. The women of a community would often discuss an unborn child's possible characteristics at great length. My perception then and now was that this was done in a loving and supportive manner.

Personally I wouldn't be so crass to ask someone about an unborn child's characteristics. But if an aged and possibly dotty relative asked about mine I wouldn't automatically wave the racist card. Because context matters.
 

thirdtry

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Yep, it was the 1940s but the context is crucial. The interest shown in the unborn child's skin tone was a loving one and a discussion in which the child's parents actively engaged in. But that's just my ma speaking 'her truth' based upon her 'lived experience'.

As an aside, my own encounter with something similar occurred in east Africa in the 1980s. The women of a community would often discuss an unborn child's possible characteristics at great length. My perception then and now was that this was done in a loving and supportive manner.

Personally I wouldn't be so crass to ask someone about an unborn child's characteristics. But if an aged and possibly dotty relative asked about mine I wouldn't automatically wave the racist card. Because context matters.

Little bit relevant: spent a week or so in Nanyuki a few years ago on an Expedition. A suspiciously high number of mixed-race kids cutting about. I wonder if the locals pondered over potential skin colours in the 9 months after any major British Army exercise!
 

Aerial

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Yep, it was the 1940s but the context is crucial. The interest shown in the unborn child's skin tone was a loving one and a discussion in which the child's parents actively engaged in. But that's just my ma speaking 'her truth' based upon her 'lived experience'.
Context is crucial. Nowadays "colourism" in India is seen as quite a big problem for their society, and also within the diaspora in the UK and elsewhere.

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200818-colourism-in-india-the-people-fighting-light-skin-bias
 

ThreadpigeonsAlpha

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I don’t see the harm in the royal family investigating the claims made in the interview themselves and either showing that it’s lies or reprimanding the people involved. I find the public outrage against Harry and Megan giving an interview compared to the lack of outrage and media coverage over prince Andrew’s alleged involvement with Jeffrey Epstein and the allegations against him quite worrying. I completely respect the royal family, I just think like everybody else’s they aren’t perfect and should be held accountable when it’s deserved or prove that they have done nothing wrong and maintain their reputation.
That’s anecdotal. There’s a lot of people who think Prince Andrew should be fully investigated and if so face the consequences.
No one is above the law. Not even the Royals.
The problem is, with social media, big tech, media and algorithms a lot of people are only shown their own views or shown a section of the views held, becoming encased in their own echo chambers.

They of course sh be investigating Meghans claims however it was out of order for her to air dirty laundry in public.
This is the Royal family not some Jeremy Kyle rejects.
Let’s not forget that there’s substantial claims that Meghan was a bully and a nightmare to work for.


So you are happy for the Royals to be held accountable and have responsibility for their actions? And what about Meghan and Harry, are they not accountable or have responsibilities too?

The main reason why people are turning against them is because they are total
Gobsh1tes.

Harry sits there and spews stuff about racism yet turned up to a fancy dress party dressed as a Nazi Officer. Also accused of referring to a fellow officer by a racial slur.
Meghan sits and gobs off about wanting to live in peace without the Royals and live a “normal life” yet doesn’t stop gobbing off about it, betraying her own family and selling herself out proving she’s a fame hungry, attention seeking, manipulative little madam. Thinking she’s on Jerry Springer.

Both of them sit there in incredible positions of privilege and then have the nerve to sh1t on anyone beneath them and make us out to be bad people?

You sit there in your private jet, gobbing off at me for driving to ASDA and killing the world, because I’m a racist, bigot and a terrible person? Aye Good one.

Just hand back the titles and the tax money and off you pop.
 

ThreadpigeonsAlpha

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Context is crucial. Nowadays "colourism" in India is seen as quite a big problem for their society, and also within the diaspora in the UK and elsewhere.

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200818-colourism-in-india-the-people-fighting-light-skin-bias
Oh my days. I’ve heard it all now.

Supply and Demand. If you don’t want it, don’t buy it. Simple.

Is it “colourist” that many women in western countries try and darken their skins?
Is both situations “cultural appropriation” ?(which isn’t a real thing, just made up nonsense)
 

Nature's Wish

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Has anyone else seen clips of the interview Meghan & Harry had with Oprah about the Royal Family? She said that they were concerned with the colour of skin their baby would be and that also she was having suicidal thoughts. I guess we’ll never know if it’s true or not but it’s a pretty big thing to throw about. The show aired in America yesterday but its airing today in the UK at 9pm if anyone wants to watch it in full.
Personally don't care about the one that walked from royalty nor his woman. Same goes for the royal family... But don't tell anyone I said that, lest I am beheaded or exiled.
 

Jaykay2343

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If I'm honest, what is actually wrong about speculating how dark or light an unborn child skin colour is? Especially between mixed race parents? I honestly can't see the harm in it. What offence has actually been caused?
 

Aerial

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Oh my days. I’ve heard it all now.

Supply and Demand. If you don’t want it, don’t buy it. Simple.

Is it “colourist” that many women in western countries try and darken their skins?
Is both situations “cultural appropriation” ?(which isn’t a real thing, just made up nonsense)
The root of the problem isn't that the products are available, it's the discrimination/societal pressure people face that makes them need or want to use them in the first place.

Historically speaking skin complexion has been used to convey status or power. In days gone by wealthy people liked to look pale because it showed they didn't need to toil outside. Nowadays people like to be tanned because it shows they can afford expensive holidays abroad.

Beauty standards change over time, but there are clear links between that standard and what confers status or power within that culture.
 

Nature's Wish

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It's just culture that decides. Humans as rational beings is an illusion. This year's made that clear.

There's no reason why in the future picking on gingers might be seen as 100 x worse than doing it with skin colour. Or we might even see slavery as a good again - the ancients thought it was right and just that conflict should decide who should perform the necessary indentured servitude required to build a society. (We just outsource the guilt of that now onto regimes that don't care, but we're still happy to trade with and build alliances with). What is right and wrong, and seen to be, just depends on who controls the narrative.
On this current trend I don't see that happening with gingers (or should I say gingas? ). As it stands gingers are Caucasian or white so you can't be racist towards them (according to some incredibly woke gentlemen on the Twitters).
 

Nature's Wish

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If I'm honest, what is actually wrong about speculating how dark or light an unborn child skin colour is? Especially between mixed race parents? I honestly can't see the harm in it. What offence has actually been caused?
People will say the implication is a lighter skinned child is superior. But that is simply an assumption that an otherwise innocent question is malicious.
That said it is entirely up to the parents to decide if they want a darker or lighter skinned child or if they think one is better than the other. Better depends on circumstances and if others also want to speculate, I say so be it. As it stands many people associate a darker skinned child as a virtue in and of itself.
 

Chelonian

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As it stands gingers are Caucasian or white so you can't be racist towards them (according to some incredibly woke gentlemen on the Twitters).
Racial slurs can be directed at any of us, regardless of ethnic heritage and skin tone.

I believe that within the next fifty years many genetic characteristics will be protected by law as are race, disability, faith, etc.
I don't have a problem with that but it is sad that decency and our behaviour towards each other should have to be defined and regulated by law.
 

Nature's Wish

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Racial slurs can be directed at any of us, regardless of ethnic heritage and skin tone.

I believe that within the next fifty years many genetic characteristics will be protected by law as are race, disability, faith, etc.
I don't have a problem with that but it is sad that decency and our behaviour towards each other should have to be defined and regulated by law.
Perhaps. I agree wholeheartedly it is sad that decency and morals must be the regulated by law rather than upheld by society itself. But we've came a long way and this is a long time coming. As it stands on the scale of the world, Caucasian whites are actually a minority, huddled up mainly in Europe. And with a declining population (more deaths than births) as well as demographic replacement in Europe, well, the writing is ok the wall. Caucasian whites won't be around much longer.
 

Nature's Wish

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Eh? I won't even ask how they might accomplish that.
Hahaha. Well, I meant debate it or simply hope for it, I suppose. Outside of that just picking a partner that suits your preference. Yeah, I could have worded that better my bad.
 
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