National Anthem.

himself

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I dont mind taking an oath of allegiance - the queen is just another boss and the marines a job but some one asked me the other day if id be singing 'god save the queen' now as an irish man it poses a problem - so the question is thus - would there ever be a time were you would be expected to sing the anthem? it dosnt seem right for non UK citizens so im hoping i can just stand and think of Ireland....
 

jm745

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I dont mind taking an oath of allegiance - the queen is just another boss and the marines a job but some one asked me the other day if id be singing 'god save the queen' now as an irish man it poses a problem - so the question is thus - would there ever be a time were you would be expected to sing the anthem? it dosnt seem right for non UK citizens so im hoping i can just stand and think of Ireland....

Well you will be fighting for Britain,
so if you are prepared to die for Britain,
I don't see why you would be miffed about singing the national anthem of the country you are serving?
 

AdmiralAwesome

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I'm not all together too happy about swearing allegiance to the Queen and singing the national anthem either... I'd much rather swear an oath to the elected government of this country. Flawed it may be, at least I had some part in choosing them.

But at the end of the day, the whole business of swearing allegiance to the Queen is just a symbolic tradition. The Queen has no control over the Armed Forces, and your boss is the government. It's just a bit of pomp and circumstance. Pay lip service. I don't think anyone honestly believes they're fighting for the Queen.
 

himself

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God save 'our' gracious queen... she isnt my queen - she'll be my employer..... ill be an Irish soldier in an English army - im not political and i dont bare historical grudges... thats all in the past - Im an Irish Citizen from a nation governed as a democratic republic - not a commonwealth - im proud of my country's history and respectful to those that insured its independence, and as such i just feel it would be hypocritical of me to sing any anthem other than my own. Im not putting the anthem down.. im not saying ive anything against Mrs Windsor - how many English would be willing to sing the French Anthem?

I want to be a soldier.. a professional soldier - a man dosnt join a foreign army out of patriotic duty..
 

jm745

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God save 'our' gracious queen... she isnt my queen - she'll be my employer..... ill be an Irish soldier in an English army - im not political and i dont bare historical grudges... thats all in the past - Im an Irish Citizen from a nation governed as a democratic republic - not a commonwealth - im proud of my country's history and respectful to those that insured its independence, and as such i just feel it would be hypocritical of me to sing any anthem other than my own. Im not putting the anthem down.. im not saying ive anything against Mrs Windsor - how many English would be willing to sing the French Anthem?

I want to be a soldier.. a professional soldier - a man dosnt join a foreign army out of patriotic duty..

But if somebody attacks Britain you would be defending British soil,
and you would be fighting to help the British people,
and if you are proud to do that,
then why are you not proud to sing the anthem?

I wouldn't mind singing the French national anthem if I fought alongside French troops,
if they wanted me to sing their anthem,
I would do so as I respect them.
 

himself

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But if somebody attacks Britain you would be defending British soil,
and you would be fighting to help the British people,
and if you are proud to do that,
then why are you not proud to sing the anthem?

I wouldn't see it as simply as defending British soil or British people... id see it as defence against an aggressor regardless of nationality. fighting because its the right thing to do.

any ways.. regardless if you feel comfortable singing any other national anthem thats your call..

This Irish man is just a little too proud
 

AdmiralAwesome

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I really don't understand why there is such an issue with singing the national anthem of another country.

If you're joining another country's armed forces, you're adopting that country as a second 'home.' It doesen't mean forgetting or betraying your original country. Most of the Ghurkas who join the British Armed Forces love Nepal and Britain.
 

himself

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Well maybe its just an Irish thing... we spent a long bloody time fighting for an anthem that wasn't god save the king/queen! :p
 

spartan

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i agree with the irishman. there is a line in the anthem that says "cast out the rebelious scots" am i meant to sing this !?! ...singing about casting myself out......
 

Geryon

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It's just a bunch of words, if you have trouble saying them then I honestly don't know you are going to deal with other morals of yours you might have to break.
 

southerncomfort

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<Quote>"Well maybe its just an Irish thing... we spent a long bloody time fighting for an anthem that wasn't god save the king/queen! :p"<Quote>

<Quote>"This Irish man is just a little too proud"<Quote>

If these statements are true then why are you joining a "foreign" force at all. Surley you would be proud to join your own defence forces and not have to worry about singing any other national anthem.

If you want to join another team you have to accept their customs and traditions along with it.
 

himself

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If these statements are true then why are you joining a "foreign" force at all. Surley you would be proud to join your own defence forces and not have to worry about singing any other national anthem.

If you want to join another team you have to accept their customs and traditions along with it.

I was proud to join my own defence forces - ive spent 9 years as a Reserve soldier but im too old now to join full time and a full time career in the Irish Army dosnt offer me the same challenges and rewards as a carer in the Royal Marines.

as for customs and traditions - im not seeking citizenship, just like if i joined the police or postal service its just a carer, a job.

England is a modern multi-cultural society and at last check its institutions military included reflected that.
 

southerncomfort

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Yes this is a multicultural society and our uniformed services reflect that, but they all also pledge allegiance to the queen. Its not a matter of of seeking citizenship its simply down to the fact that if you want to play on our team you should accept our rules and customs, plain and simple, doesnt matter if its joining the forces and pledging allegiance to the Queen or joining the postal service and following whatever rules and customs that they set out.
 

spartan

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Yes this is a multicultural society and our uniformed services reflect that, but they all also pledge allegiance to the queen. Its not a matter of of seeking citizenship its simply down to the fact that if you want to play on our team you should accept our rules and customs, plain and simple, doesnt matter if its joining the forces and pledging allegiance to the Queen or joining the postal service and following whatever rules and customs that they set out.

how enthusiastic would you be if you had to sing the anthem that said "cast out the english" ?
 

southerncomfort

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If i was going to join someone else i would have the respect to accept their customs and that would include singing their anthem with casting out the english if need be. If i had a problem with doing that then i wouldnt go in the first place.
 

Ninja_Stoker

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I dont mind taking an oath of allegiance - the queen is just another boss and the marines a job but some one asked me the other day if id be singing 'god save the queen' now as an irish man it poses a problem - so the question is thus - would there ever be a time were you would be expected to sing the anthem? it dosnt seem right for non UK citizens so im hoping i can just stand and think of Ireland....

You have no choice with regard the oath of allegiance, you either take the oath or don't join. A dashed inconvenience, but it's the British Armed Forces old chap.

With regard the National Anthem, if you're joining the Royal Marines Band Service you will be expected to play it rather than producing a fiddle and busking an Irish Jig in the middle of a riff. Other than that, in 27 years military service I do not recall seeing anyone singing, or indeed knowing all the words, to the British National Anthem. Conversely I've heard many a Scotsman recount every verse to "Flower of Scotland" and sing it full volume, usually whilst everyone else is trying to sleep.
 

spartan

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If i was going to join someone else i would have the respect to accept their customs and that would include singing their anthem with casting out the english if need be. If i had a problem with doing that then i wouldnt go in the first place.

i have more pride then to be singing about casting out my own people
 

Jervis

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England maybe a very multiethnic country, but i think the day England changes there national athem to suit visitors will be the day English pride and tradition will go out the window. I dont consider myself English i consider myself British as a part of Britain you would think there wouldn't be any problems with the national athem.... Some people are too soft in my opinion.

And as for the Queen since when does an Englishman dislike his Queen!
 

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