Sponsored Ad

Dismiss Notice
For fuller site visibility and advert-free browsing, simply log-in or register.

Featured Orthotics - Change in Medical Standard For Entry (Aug 2019)

Discussion in 'General Royal Marines Joining Chit Chat' started by Ninja_Stoker, Sep 27, 2019.

  1. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Admin

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Posts:
    34,278
    Some (hopefully) good news:

    JSP 950 Leaflet 6-7-7 Musculo Skeletal Pre-Entry, Annex K (V1.6 Aug 19)

    Now states:

    Para 54. Foot Deformities

    Candidates with minor conditions that allow the usage of normal footwear (with orthotics if necessary) and are asymptomatic during activity comparable with military training for 3 months are FIT.

    a) Candidates who use custom-made footwear are normally UNFIT
    b) Those who require an orthotic but can use issued boots are normally FIT
     
    • Like Like x 4
    • Gucci Info Gucci Info x 1
  2. Breeze2

    Breeze2 New Member

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2019
    Posts:
    10
    App Stage:
    TMU
    So if the candidate can run with the custom insoles for 3 months they are now deemed fit and are allowed to wear custom insoles during RT?
     
  3. beddyb

    beddyb New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2019
    Posts:
    6
    App Stage:
    Passed PJFT
    I'd like to add in to this: I broke my fibula (mid leg and lower down, near my ankle) in two places in March 2018. When I applied after a year (breaking of long bones requires 1 year of recovery before you can apply), I was told that usually, a break through or very close to a joint would be an instant fail at the medical stage. The only reason I even got to the medical stage was because of what the consultant had written about how well my break had healed. I also had a history (my Strava profile and various running groups that I'm part of) of running that I could provide at the medical, which the doctor said would definitely help my case. My case was referred to a senior review board and I was passed based on evidence I'd provided, examination at medical and consultant referral notes.

    What I'd encourage anyone with this kind of issue to do is to:
    1) Document everything. Every time you run, cycle, swim, gym; write down how you felt, any pains or aches you suffered, what the weather was like etc. The more detail you can provide, the more authentic your training diary looks and it will be taken into greater consideration at review. Using things like Strava is even better because it's quite difficult to fake a long history of running.
    2) Go to the doctors and get your injury re-examined. Ask them to provide you with a letter stating that you are fit and that the injury no longer causes you any concerns.
     
    • Gucci Info Gucci Info x 1
  4. Chelonian

    Chelonian Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Posts:
    8,198
    @Ninja_Stoker Does this change mean that prescribed (presumably custom by definition) orthotics remain a bar to entry?
     
  5. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Admin

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Posts:
    34,278
    The way I read it is prescribed orthotics are no longer a bar to entry providing the individual meets the stated criteria in producing a 3 month, unbroken training diary without injury related symptoms such as shin splints (etc) and can wear standard military issue footwear.

    Obviously this is subject to verification by the medical examiner on a case by case basis together the production of a medical history that shows no recurrence of lower limb injuries since prescribed orthotics.

    In other words, anyone knocked-back on the grounds of prescribed orthotics should gather their supporting evidence then consider reapplying so that they may undergo a medical review.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Nailed It Nailed It x 1
  6. Illustrious

    Illustrious Royal Marines Commando - Moderator

    Joined:
    May 13, 2008
    Posts:
    2,255
    That'd be me in that bracket. Could have been discharged due to spastic feet. Instead, the corps invested £300* in a pair of orthotics for me and have so far got over 11 years of service out of me.

    *Itd be much more, but I didn't realise you were supposed to renew the orthotics every year. I found out at the 10 year point.
     
    • Hoofin Hoofin x 4
    • Like Like x 3
  7. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Admin

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Posts:
    34,278
    Good points raised.

    Firstly, if you have related injuries in years 2-9 after being prescribed orthotics by the service, then the AFCS applies.

    Before anyone thinks I'm promoting a "compensation culture', a service person ain't a doing the job for charity. If the UK government holds service personnel to account for their actions whilst performing their duties under their direction operationally, the government is equally liable when their duty of care falls short of that mandated.

    Secondly, any recruit or trained rank prescribed orthotics, subsequently denied re-entry should consider re-applying. If the condition (or any other) is service attributed and prevents re-entry, again the AFCS applies.

    By the way, for anyone considering submitting an AFCS claim - Never use a solicitor, do it yourself unless you want to pay someone else an exorbitant fee to undertake a very simple evolution on your behalf.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. TheRents

    TheRents Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2017
    Posts:
    149
    App Stage:
    Parent
    Is this a tri-service standard by any chance?

    Many Thanks
     
  9. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Admin

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Posts:
    34,278
    The quote in post #1 is a tri-service publication but each service may well interpret the rules slightly differently.
     
  10. TheRents

    TheRents Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2017
    Posts:
    149
    App Stage:
    Parent
    Thank you
     
  11. BillyTheKid

    BillyTheKid Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2016
    Posts:
    103
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    Can recruits in RT use insoles which improve comfort in camp boots? Cheers
     
  12. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Admin

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Posts:
    34,278
    A difficult one.

    Whilst appreciating prevention is better than cure, I would have thought the best option is go to the Med Centre if you have issues during recruit training - they can prescribe orthotic insoles free of charge if they are required. Off-the-shelf insoles such as Sorbothane should be OK, but I'd still be inclined to ask whilst on PRMC or your training team upon arrival at CTC.

    If you pitch-up with orthotics, having passed the pre-entry medical, you are effectively declaring a previous medical issue, which could still lead to discharge if you later develop related lower limb issues.
     
  13. Chelonian

    Chelonian Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Posts:
    8,198
    I'll come at this from a different tack. It may seem like I'm stating the bleedin' obvious but everyone should ensure that they select the correct size boots. If aged in one's teens or early twenties don't just assume that the size of your trotters is the same as it was, say, three years ago.

    The ancient, much loved (not) Boots DMS issued back in the day came in three width fittings for most sizes: Small, Medium or Large.
    Someone on here might confirm if the same sizing standards apply to the current issue Haix and Altberg boots.
     
  14. Illustrious

    Illustrious Royal Marines Commando - Moderator

    Joined:
    May 13, 2008
    Posts:
    2,255
    @BillyTheKid @Ninja_Stoker correct me if I'm wrong but are you just referring to non-gait altering insoles?

    Eg, I used to use the drill boots insoles in my boots as they were insanely comfortable without it changing my gait. (I had a separate hard insole for that)
     
  15. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Admin

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Posts:
    34,278
    Yep, ordinary insoles for comfort, rather than injury prevention should be OK but again, as with many things, I don't want to contradict the training team's take on this as they may have a reason for advising against it.
     
  16. Illustrious

    Illustrious Royal Marines Commando - Moderator

    Joined:
    May 13, 2008
    Posts:
    2,255
    I'm sure the training team always have their reasons, but I'll be damned if I can figure out why we weren't allowed the webbing hip pads until week 10! So many unnecessary injuries and scarring for what?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  17. JWJ

    JWJ Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    718
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    If I remember right, the med centre told us during foundation that if we went there and complained about our feet, they're able to make insoles for us - but I would assume theres a risk of getting diagnosed with shin splints/various other injuries and hunter coy.
     
  18. Chelonian

    Chelonian Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Posts:
    8,198
    Luxury! When I were a lad we made our own from the foam stuffing of an old sofa. :)
     
    • Hoofin Hoofin x 1
  19. Illustrious

    Illustrious Royal Marines Commando - Moderator

    Joined:
    May 13, 2008
    Posts:
    2,255
    Old sofas? When I were a nod, we didn't even have a sofa to make our 'ip pads out of, we had to make do with last week's newspapers, if we had some spare from making our mattresses.
     
    • Hoofin Hoofin x 1
  20. Chelonian

    Chelonian Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Posts:
    8,198
    Luxury.
    Eee... in the 70s we didn't have last week's newspapers because nobody could afford to buy a newspaper. Even the old ones which wrote about King George V's funeral. Foam stuffing from an ancient, piss-stained sofa wrapped around a 58-pattern belt and pouches could only be dreamt of.
    As for mattresses we stuffed ours with rocks and even then we were told that we had it soft. :)
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Hoofin Hoofin x 1