PRMC -16-28 results

Discussion in 'PRMC Itself - The Results, The Latest News' started by Ninja_Stoker, Dec 9, 2016.

  1. Chelonian

    Chelonian Well-Known Member

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    Standards. Perception applies. I'll throw something into the mix just for the debate. A devil's advocate question:

    Suppose the physical standards are lowered but the 'state of mind' standards are enhanced?
     
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  2. Caversham

    Caversham Former RM Commando

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    The State of Mind would be responsible for more people wrapping than any physical elements. We have all been there, soaked wet through, cold, tired, hungry and being run ragged by the TT, with the prospect of a full kit inspection/crash move/no promised transport etc and with several days before Endex is declared and your promised long weekend being cancelled.

    That will test the resolve of anybody, much more than any physical activity.

    Alan
     
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  3. Grimey Arches

    Grimey Arches Well-Known Member

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    I though the whole idea of introducing the PJFT before attending a PRMC was stop so many applicants failing the first criteria test, doesn't seem sensible to change the run time considering you will have more applicants fail the course who attend with poor run times and most likely will fail the course even more so, and the money wasted on the PJFT test.

    Seems to me it will most likely cause more applicants have more attempts at passing a PRMC because of lowering of times and depending on the return time given by PRM TT more PJFT's and medicals been retaken.
     
  4. 22012016

    22012016 Member

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    I thought the physical tests were there to demonstrate you had the required State of Mind. You can put people in "the oggin" or cancel transport as often as you like to increase "resilience". But criteria tests like a 12 mile load carry or 6ft wall, will ultimately be the same.

    Broadening the initial parameters to let more people join even though they might have great heart is only doing a disservice to all involved further down the line.
     
  5. Durxza

    Durxza Member

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    Just speaking from personal experience now that I'm 4 weeks into RT (I was on one of the last "old school" PRMC's prior to the changes) Some of the lads that are worst at conventional "running" are at the front for load carries and equally some of the lads that are dealing with weighted runs the best struggle with the cold. Everyone is good at something.

    My point is as long as you all get the job done as a collective troop the training team seem reasonably happy; the emphasis throughout training so far has been '1 in all in' and that even if you're perfect at every aspect of training, it doesn't mean anything unless you're the sort of person who is willing to then go and help those who aren't doing so well.

    I'd argue that "heart" is the one thing they ARE looking for as it cannot be taught. Our PTI's are constantly telling us that all they require is 100% effort as they can work with that whereas if you're an uber fit monster who is a complete t*text deleted*t then they don't want you to be there, full stop.
     
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  6. 22012016

    22012016 Member

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    Unselfishness and determination, it goes without saying they are crucial and you won't get far without them.

    It's just safeguarding the necessary physical standards rather than changing criteria for the sake of being inclusive.

    As a side note, I know a current marine who on his third prmc failed the run back but demonstrated sufficient heart that the prmc team passed him. He's been in the Corps just over 3 yrs now and he's quite enjoying it from all accounts.

    Best of luck with the rest of training
     
  7. Chelonian

    Chelonian Well-Known Member

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    You are of course correct. But my pondering was about how the perception of a PRMC candidate's "heart" as @Durxza appropriately terms it might become even more significant.

    If one reads through enough PRMC diaries on the forum there are occasions where a candidate has failed a particular test—for example by suffering exhaustion to the point of collapse—yet has performed well otherwise, clearly demonstrated the required grit and determination and has been awarded a pass.

    Another striking example was the candidate who arrived at his PRMC last year unable to swim. He apparently impressed in every other test criteria and he was awarded a pass which was conditional on him learning to swim before starting RT. In that case, I believe that the Royal Marines even funded his swimming lessons.
     
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  8. AC90

    AC90 New Member

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    So after you've passed your medical they do another screening? I don't get how they miss anything the first time round
     
  9. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Careers Adviser

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    Things can get missed if the applicant isn't honest, usually they are picked up. Medical records are also checked upon commencing recruit training and again under the '56 day rule' if any pre-existing condition/injury occurs in the first eight weeks.

    We've had people knowingly join with asthma, acl reconstruction surgery, spinal injuries, psychiatric illnesses, you name it.

    Some fail to grasp the simple concept that whilst in combat the last thing you need during a contact is some idiot making themselves a self inflicted casualty by having an asthma attack, blacking out, having migraine, sciatica etc. and inadvertantly taking out another three or four people and a MERT helicopter crew who have to conduct a Casevac in the middle of it all.

    Yes, it happens.
     
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  10. Grimey Arches

    Grimey Arches Well-Known Member

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    I have to admit it I understand the meaning by having heart and giving it your all but at the end of the day if you don't meet the require standards then you shouldn't be allowed to pass, this is only my opinion and from someone who has failed PRMC on H&H.

    If I was aloud to pass there or on the run back if I stopped and keeled over I wouldn't feel it was fair on all the other lads who make the grade, having heart in my opinion is failing because you didn't meet the standards but returned and smashed it.

    Just my two cents,
     
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  11. Ninja_Stoker

    Ninja_Stoker Careers Adviser

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    The idea of the PJFT is to reduce fails on the 3 miler on the PRMC.

    As stated elsewhere the standards for achieving a pass on PRMC has raised incrementally year on year over the last decade to reduce training risk.

    Prior to the introduction of the PRMC (and before that, the PRC) training fails were running at about 70-80% I believe.

    We have now reached a stage where the pass/fail rate in Recruit Training is not improving despite the raising of the pass/fail bar on PRMC. The idea of PRMC is to reduce training wastage for those yet to enter into recruit training. Recruit Training and the Commando Tests remain unchanged.

    PRMC is a constantly evolving creature, it always has been, hence the usefulness of PRMC diaries on here. The assumption that standards are being lowered to facilitate females entering into recruit training is incorrect.

    In truth it is beginning to look like females will need to be evaluated over a longer period prior to entry because of the perceived hightened risk of injury. Unequal? Maybe, but as a taxpayer I would rather minimise the cost of future prospective compensation claims arising from preventable injury.
     
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