Transfer from RMR Trained Ranks to regular RM

Chelonian

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As a fully paid-up old fart I'll kick the can along Memory Lane:

Back in the 1970s a bloke in my Recruit Platoon at Depot Para had previously served as a Trained Rank in 15 PARA (SV). He quietly got on with everything but helped out lads who were clearly struggling with admin. Someone in the TT had flicked through the personal files and demanded to know why he wasn’t wearing his wings on his rig. His answer? “I didn’t want to be different from everyone else.

He was reserved and humble and quietly demonstrated his ability without the requirement of a badge to validate it.
 

Sniper11!

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I've already said this on another thread recently but @Chelonian you once said to me "The credit lies with the man, NOT the cap badge". Seems like an appropriate piece of advice for this thread.
 

Bootra

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I imagine that after reading this thread some that are planning on joining the RMR may be having second thoughts because they don’t want to go through all that training to be seen as sub standard. I imagine that some RMR trained ranks aren’t feeling too pleased, and I’m sure that members of RMR training teams are feeling pretty threaders.

There can be no dispute that skill fade and lack of continuous training causes issues for RMR ranks. There are a number of problems within the organisation when it comes to trained ranks and how they are used and utilised once out of training.

But one thing to bare in mind is that the RMR also consists of a good number of ex regulars, lads that have been operational, and attached regulars. The training teams are made up of these ranks. They are professional and hold themselves to the same standards as those within the regular Corps. The last thing they allow is a sub standard recruit who cannot achieve the simple things such as putting a rifle together. The final assessments of the recruits are made by regular training teams on the RFCC. To imply that the majority of RMR ranks are lazy knackers is not only insulting to them, but also to the men who have trained them.

On the last Herrick tour that brigade undertook, 100 RMR ranks mobilised, mainly to 42 and 45. It did not take long for them to come up to speed and embed within their Company’s. These men did everything their regular counterparts did. They fought, they were wounded and maimed, and they collected the body parts of their fallen brothers.

I’m Ex regular and have been a member of RMR training teams for over a decade.
 

Collieryboy

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I imagine that after reading this thread some that are planning on joining the RMR may be having second thoughts because they don’t want to go through all that training to be seen as sub standard. I imagine that some RMR trained ranks aren’t feeling too pleased, and I’m sure that members of RMR training teams are feeling pretty threaders.

There can be no dispute that skill fade and lack of continuous training causes issues for RMR ranks. There are a number of problems within the organisation when it comes to trained ranks and how they are used and utilised once out of training.

But one thing to bare in mind is that the RMR also consists of a good number of ex regulars, lads that have been operational, and attached regulars. The training teams are made up of these ranks. They are professional and hold themselves to the same standards as those within the regular Corps. The last thing they allow is a sub standard recruit who cannot achieve the simple things such as putting a rifle together. The final assessments of the recruits are made by regular training teams on the RFCC. To imply that the majority of RMR ranks are lazy knackers is not only insulting to them, but also to the men who have trained them.

On the last Herrick tour that brigade undertook, 100 RMR ranks mobilised, mainly to 42 and 45. It did not take long for them to come up to speed and embed within their Company’s. These men did everything their regular counterparts did. They fought, they were wounded and maimed, and they collected the body parts of their fallen brothers.

I’m Ex regular and have been a member of RMR training teams for over a decade.
It is disheartening. I don't think anyone would assume there's no difference at all. But reading this thread makes you wonder if it'd be worth putting all that effort in for months. Im not able to join the regs and have been looking at RMR and 4 para but not sure if I will. For most RMR nods passing the RFCC will be the biggest achievement in their lives. I know 4 para have a similar issue with the regs. There's even been a few threads on arrse about it lately.
 

Chelonian

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It's fair that personal experiences are posted so that others can consider them and make up their own minds.

Rather than being a blanket condemnation of RMR it is perhaps an illustration that it takes only a very few individuals to create a poor impression which then sticks to everyone.

As stated before, what appears to be being criticised is not sub-standard skills but poor attitude.

Although it was many years ago 4 PARA, 10 PARA and 15 PARA (SV) frequently trained on exercise with Regular Para units. I mentioned in a PM to someone here yesterday that I cannot recall ever coming across a TA 'toilet'. To be honest this surprised me because the TA blokes were very closely scrutinised for evidence of not being of the required standard.
 

TheRents

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It is disheartening.
And also disappointing on a forum where the primary task is to encourage and help those wishing to join The Corps.

Posts that appear to condemn whole sections of the organisation as sub-standard are at best counterproductive, especially when given by those who's current role gives their opinion added weight.

Both full-time and reserve forces have a role to play in the world we live in. Whilst a reserve's 'hard skills' may not be at the level of their full-time colleagues, their 'soft' skills can be streets ahead.

At the present time, regardless of what those who think about training rather than being trained to think may wish, you are far more likely to be deployed in a role where opening doors is more useful than kicking them in.

As a Reservist you are managing to juggle two often conflicting roles, something to be admired not belittled!

Best of luck
 

Johnny_Anonie

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This thread is fantastic as it offers a range of differing opinions and personal experiences. This is why I am a big believer in running an idea past multiple people and picking out the gems of advice and learning.

However I think it’s important to point out that no matter what anyone else says you really should be true to yourself. If you want to apply to join RMR do it. If you want to apply as a Regular do it. Neither are easy and only a small percentage of people will be capable of achieving that green lid.

I appreciate this is almost painfully cliche, but I think it’s crucial for development. It was a valuable lesson I didn’t learn until I joined the Army. When other people's opinions are more important than your own you live life on their terms and that can harm your potential. If you start paying less and less attention to what makes you an individual you start playing it safe. You become afraid of what will happen on the other side of the critique. You’ll fear being ridiculed or rejected. When challenged, you’ll surrender your viewpoint. These shouldn’t be the qualities of a Commando. I don’t pay my taxes for an elite fighting force to be over sensitive people. We rightly expect Royal Marines to be self confident professionals.

Our fear of other people’s opinions has become an irrational and unproductive obsession these days and you really can opt out of it. I was quiet and introverted in school. I was painfully shy and much preferred keeping myself to myself. I remember saying to a few people as a teenager I wanted to join the Forces and it was largely met with dismissive comments. But I had that light bulb moment and thought fcuk it. Once I finally stopped caring so much about what other people thought and followed my own path, my life got significantly better. I became a Combat Medic and have since achieved things I never thought possible.

Never underestimate the power and freedom that washes over you when you commit to being true to yourself. I have worked alongside Royal Marines both on tour and on courses. As a combat medic much of our training was tri service. Hand on heart I always found Royal Marines to be switched on, friendly and mature blokes. They didn’t isolate themselves nor did they look down on us. They tended to treat each man as they found them. We always had a great laugh with bootnecks. It really boils down to being a decent person.
If you focus on being yourself people, no matter the colour of their beret, will see that realness. If someone dislikes you for merely being a reservist accept it, move on, and just keep doing your best.

Just be yourself.
 

Kingsman

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These RMR failings have given me even more motivation to change your opinion! If I ever stand before you at CTCRM maybe one day you'll change your opinion to "Out of all the time I have worked with them only two of them seemed to be decent." A man can dream right?
Make that three...at least!
 

Rover

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Once provided 'enemy' for an RMR major exercise.:cool:
Excellent all around in their actions, they had a 2" mortar team which thankfully was using smoke and not HE!o_O:eek:;):)
 

Blackers

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I imagine that after reading this thread some that are planning on joining the RMR may be having second thoughts because they don’t want to go through all that training to be seen as sub standard. I imagine that some RMR trained ranks aren’t feeling too pleased, and I’m sure that members of RMR training teams are feeling pretty threaders.

There can be no dispute that skill fade and lack of continuous training causes issues for RMR ranks. There are a number of problems within the organisation when it comes to trained ranks and how they are used and utilised once out of training.

But one thing to bare in mind is that the RMR also consists of a good number of ex regulars, lads that have been operational, and attached regulars. The training teams are made up of these ranks. They are professional and hold themselves to the same standards as those within the regular Corps. The last thing they allow is a sub standard recruit who cannot achieve the simple things such as putting a rifle together. The final assessments of the recruits are made by regular training teams on the RFCC. To imply that the majority of RMR ranks are lazy knackers is not only insulting to them, but also to the men who have trained them.

On the last Herrick tour that brigade undertook, 100 RMR ranks mobilised, mainly to 42 and 45. It did not take long for them to come up to speed and embed within their Company’s. These men did everything their regular counterparts did. They fought, they were wounded and maimed, and they collected the body parts of their fallen brothers.

I’m Ex regular and have been a member of RMR training teams for over a decade.
Totally agree with the above post I’ve quoted. In the grand scheme of things as an Ex Reg Infantry soldier I don’t care one jot if @Royal2010 wants to tar all reserves with on brush. I also couldn’t care less what he thinks.
@Bootra on the other hand isn’t a sprog on his first screw posting and I will take what he says as gospel.

@Royal2010 I think you need to check your ego lad.
 

Blackers

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These RMR failings have given me even more motivation to change your opinion! If I ever stand before you at CTCRM maybe one day you'll change your opinion to "Out of all the time I have worked with them only two of them seemed to be decent." A man can dream right?
This post has made me vomit.
Here’s my take on it. I really don’t care if a regular NCO has had a few bad experiences and has a chip on his shoulder. As we say in Belfast, dead on mate. Seeing posts like the above is cringy beyond belief. You do not have to prove anything to him as an individual. What you should aim to do is prove to your own oppos and CoC that your a good egg willing to put the work in and if required stick your paw up for deployments and do the cap badge proud. RMR is a bit like CTC training teams in such you get the same mix you see everywhere else, from the outstanding to the utter belters.

I worked a bit with a 2 RIR det as a Regular NCO and to be honest the stable belts were definitely not under as much strain as many of the regs. Granted it is a small sample but the reservist blokes impressed me by how much of their spare time they give up to phys. There were plenty of regulars that avoided phys, which they were getting paid for, like the plague but never seemed to suffer any wrath for it.

So lads stop looking all starry eyed at @Royal2010. I’m sure he’s a nice guy but he’s no better than anyone else. He’s an NCO that’s applied. Well so are plenty others. Don’t ask regs about RMR, ask at the shop floor ( contact your local det) and find out what they actually do on their training weekends. Some posts on here have descended to little more than petty attempts at point scoring that regs are better than reserves. Grow up boys. It appears to have slipped the notice of some that the Corps is getting smaller, not larger. Right, wrong, like it or not, that is the reality. The ability to expand from the small, regular, cadre to meet any future requirement will be held in the reserves.
Remember RMR boys prob does a continual check of the balance equation: Does what I get from the RMR outweigh what I have to sacrifice for it? It’s little wonder they lose good eggs and are left with the odd belter. Lads if you are going to comitt huge amounts of time and effort into RMR do it for you and your immediate oppos!
 

Man of Steel

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This post has made me vomit.
Here’s my take on it. I really don’t care if a regular NCO has had a few bad experiences and has a chip on his shoulder. As we say in Belfast, dead on mate. Seeing posts like the above is cringy beyond belief. You do not have to prove anything to him as an individual. What you should aim to do is prove to your own oppos and CoC that your a good egg willing to put the work in and if required stick your paw up for deployments and do the cap badge proud. RMR is a bit like CTC training teams in such you get the same mix you see everywhere else, from the outstanding to the utter belters.

I worked a bit with a 2 RIR det as a Regular NCO and to be honest the stable belts were definitely not under as much strain as many of the regs. Granted it is a small sample but the reservist blokes impressed me by how much of their spare time they give up to phys. There were plenty of regulars that avoided phys, which they were getting paid for, like the plague but never seemed to suffer any wrath for it.

So lads stop looking all starry eyed at @Royal2010. I’m sure he’s a nice guy but he’s no better than anyone else. He’s an NCO that’s applied. Well so are plenty others. Don’t ask regs about RMR, ask at the shop floor ( contact your local det) and find out what they actually do on their training weekends. Some posts on here have descended to little more than petty attempts at point scoring that regs are better than reserves. Grow up boys. It appears to have slipped the notice of some that the Corps is getting smaller, not larger. Right, wrong, like it or not, that is the reality. The ability to expand from the small, regular, cadre to meet any future requirement will be held in the reserves.
Remember RMR boys prob does a continual check of the balance equation: Does what I get from the RMR outweigh what I have to sacrifice for it? It’s little wonder they lose good eggs and are left with the odd belter. Lads if you are going to comitt huge amounts of time and effort into RMR do it for you and your immediate oppos!
No one is looking "starry eyed" at anyone. There are mainly two drivers, self-motivation and perception. In civi industries those who go about half arsed get nowhere in their careers, same goes for the military, I'm happy to say that I've worked hard at my civi career and it has paid off, hence joining the RMR instead of the regs. If you plan on impressing the TT, you may as well take the advice from the guy is actually part of it. Keep your head down, put the hours in and work hard.

A smart man learns from his mistakes, a wise man learns from the mistakes of others.
 

Blackers

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No one is looking "starry eyed" at anyone. There are mainly two drivers, self-motivation and perception. In civi industries those who go about half arsed get nowhere in their careers, same goes for the military, I'm happy to say that I've worked hard at my civi career and it has paid off, hence joining the RMR instead of the regs. If you plan on impressing the TT, you may as well take the advice from the guy is actually part of it. Keep your head down, put the hours in and work hard.

A smart man learns from his mistakes, a wise man learns from the mistakes of others.
You do realise that @Royal2010 doesn’t “train” RMR he also hasn’t proffered any advice. I’d encourage you to read the comments by @Bootra on this thread who, unlike @Royal2010, has a vast experience with RMR. This isn’t a slagging match but I don’t want you falling foul of any ego trips.
 

Blackers

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And also disappointing on a forum where the primary task is to encourage and help those wishing to join The Corps.

Posts that appear to condemn whole sections of the organisation as sub-standard are at best counterproductive, especially when given by those who's current role gives their opinion added weight.

Both full-time and reserve forces have a role to play in the world we live in. Whilst a reserve's 'hard skills' may not be at the level of their full-time colleagues, their 'soft' skills can be streets ahead.

At the present time, regardless of what those who think about training rather than being trained to think may wish, you are far more likely to be deployed in a role where opening doors is more useful than kicking them in.

As a Reservist you are managing to juggle two often conflicting roles, something to be admired not belittled!

Best of luck
Best post on the thread mate. Well said.
From a personal perspective we had 2 RIR on H13. The mounting order was very detailed and prescriptive on the training objectives which had to be met to minimise the training gap between TA Infantry soldiers and us in the receiving unit. All MATTs to level 1, UGL, LMG, Sig P226, LFMT to Pl level by day and night, COIN doctrine, fitness etc, etc. Was all met by the reservists. Point being, it’s unfair to highlight entire units as useless based off some very limited exposure. But once again, well said fella! Top post!
 

GreyWing

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In my opinion I have seen @Royal2010 's posts on here for many years and I haven't seen him post with any malice or lie. I was in RMR recruit training for around 18 months. When I was on my FFEX attached to a Regular Troop, I was there as a recruit with another recruit and two green lidded RMR guys and it's almost like @Royal2010 and I were on the same course - I fully agree with him with the performance of those two RMR trained ranks.

Fortunately for me I witnessed a lot of other RMR lads and got a wider view of the RMR. But if those two Green Lidded RMR guys were all I witnessed, I would have held the same opinion. We can only say what we see, and if that is what he has seen then that is what he has seen. There isn't much point shooting the messenger. In the RMR I saw worse than he is reporting and I saw some amazing stuff.

I always got treated fairly as an RMR recruit. One Corporal at CTC that I didn't get a good vibe from but didn't bother me. If you are an RMR recruit and you let @Royal2010 s comments put you off then you probably won't last long in the RMR anyway. My Mrs gives me worse verbal each night.
 

Blackers

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In my opinion I have seen @Royal2010 's posts on here for many years and I haven't seen him post with any malice or lie. I was in RMR recruit training for around 18 months. When I was on my FFEX attached to a Regular Troop, I was there as a recruit with another recruit and two green lidded RMR guys and it's almost like @Royal2010 and I were on the same course - I fully agree with him with the performance of those two RMR trained ranks.

Fortunately for me I witnessed a lot of other RMR lads and got a wider view of the RMR. But if those two Green Lidded RMR guys were all I witnessed, I would have held the same opinion. We can only say what we see, and if that is what he has seen then that is what he has seen. There isn't much point shooting the messenger. In the RMR I saw worse than he is reporting and I saw some amazing stuff.

I always got treated fairly as an RMR recruit. One Corporal at CTC that I didn't get a good vibe from but didn't bother me. If you are an RMR recruit and you let @Royal2010 s comments put you off then you probably won't last long in the RMR anyway. My Mrs gives me worse verbal each night.
I’m not getting chopsy. Hopefully we are all big boys here and a few opinions won’t hurt any feelings. I respect the lad and he’s an asset to the regular hopefuls on here. I’ve just as many medals as him and have been round the block. I’ve oppos who lost legs and I’ve pallbearered for one too. A young lad who died prior to mert landing.So I’m sure he gets where I’m coming from and knows I mean no malice. I’d still buy him a beer I’m sure, I just don’t buy into any “don’t call me mate” nonsense.
As far as I am concerned, as @Bootra has alluded to any RMR mobilised or on FTRS will fill gaps in the regular manning structure and will be expected to do the job as well as any reg. They are, effectively, temporary regulars on ops.
I don’t buy into this notion of his that as a reg they are automatically superior to a reservist. Typing the word full time in capitals means nothing. As any of the reg lads here will attest the truth is most regs sit around for 3-and-two-halves day week fiddling on DII while drinking a lot of brews or playing X-Box in their grot, and get paid a seven-day salary for it. People of quality exist in the regs and reserves as do belters. Tarring with one brush is ridiculous, especially after only having two bad experiences. I’m also aware I’m fan girling @Bootra a tad but as he’s spent a decade training RMR I’m sorry but I’m going to back his gen.
 

GreyWing

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I’m not getting chopsy. Hopefully we are all big boys here and a few opinions won’t hurt any feelings. I respect the lad and he’s an asset to the regular hopefuls on here. I’ve just as many medals as him and have been round the block. I’ve oppos who lost legs and I’ve pallbearered for one too. A young lad who died prior to mert landing.So I’m sure he gets where I’m coming from and knows I mean no malice. I’d still buy him a beer I’m sure, I just don’t buy into any “don’t call me mate” nonsense.
Absolutely mate, no issues on here whatsoever. Just as he is saying what he see's, I'd back you to say what you have seen too. This forum is one of the few I have seen that will allow honest debate, hate those places that shut debates down.

I'm trying to keep out of the merits of the debate - deleted my last draft post several times over the last month. I factually agree with @Royal2010 and factually disagree at the same time, I have genuinely seen what he has reported, and also witnessed week 29 reg recruits do some daft things too. I just wanted to put on record that everyone has just seen different things, and that I don't think anyone is making things up or posting things they didn't believe.

If anything, we should point our disappointment towards the RMR rank that @Royal2010 witnessed.

But yep, nothing personal on anyones part. It's not a big disagreement in the scale of things.
 
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Blackers

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Oh believe me, I’ve seen some howlers too. I once seen a TA lad try and iron his gortex! I also know a reg who near set fire to his civvie locker in basic after he threw a red hot iron in there ahead of a snap room inspection!
 
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