Sponsored Ad

Dismiss Notice
For fuller site visibility and advert-free browsing, simply log-in or register.

Trump: US killed Soleimani to 'stop a war' with Iran

Discussion in 'General Military & Topical News' started by News, Jan 2, 2020.

  1. News

    News RSS Feed

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Posts:
    9,356
    Protesters have left the US embassy compound in Baghdad, but the situation remains tense.

    Continue reading...
     
  2. ThreadpigeonsAlpha

    ThreadpigeonsAlpha Royal Marines Commando

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2015
    Posts:
    4,563
    Good response from trump. Not like that dogs abortion killary turning her back and resulting in deaths of an Ambassador and security personnel.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  3. Rover

    Rover Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    Posts:
    3,782
    The USA has a history of antagonism against Iran for a number of reasons. Perhaps the main one being that they ‘lost control’ during the time of the Shah. The CIA aka ‘Christians in Action’ did not help bearing in mind that the USA supported/encouraged Saddam Hussein in the Iraq/Iran war in the 80’s.

    It was America who initially supported placing the Ayatollah in place of the Shah as they believed they could control him and therefore Iran as the Shah did not wish to be under American control to the degree the US would have liked.

    America seems to go out of its way in wishing to control countries in the Middle East, look at Iraq today!-banghead-
     
    • Seen Seen x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  4. rkec

    rkec Valuable Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2008
    Posts:
    349
    Looks like they escalated it again this morning. I think later today Iraq might ask the US to leave. Killing this head of the Quds Force is not going to go down well.
     
    • Gen Dit Gen Dit x 1
  5. JWJ

    JWJ Venerated Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    791
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    The Iraqi govt is much more likely to support the killing of Soleimani, he was actively involved in efforts to undermine and degrade Iraqi stability and was allegedly involved in a plot to stir up a coup against the Iraqi leadership. Thousands of Iraqis are celebrating Soleimani's death currently, but he also had tens of thousands of staunch supporters in the country.

    Its easy to forget that in Iran and in those circles, figureheads are also praised and celebrated in a way they just aren't in the West. Soleimani has recently become hugely popular and idolised as though a celebrity in Shiite communities. Whilst its undoubtedly true that Soleimani was an enemy of the US and the West in general, its also fair to say he was a stabiliser of sorts in the middle east, at least regarding the split between Sunni and Shiite populations and directed operations against Sunni extremists.

    His killing will be used as a catalytic signal for Iran to 'unite' Shiite communities and interests against what they will call the criminal actions of the West and particularly the US. I wouldn't be suppressed to see widespread unrest and violence in Iraq and Syria over upcoming days/weeks on the back of this.
     
    • Seen Seen x 1
    Last edited: Jan 3, 2020
  6. rkec

    rkec Valuable Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2008
    Posts:
    349
    "The war is not meant to be won, it is meant to be continuous."

    ― George Orwell
     
    • Gen Dit Gen Dit x 3
    • Like Like x 1
  7. RM_Yorkshire

    RM_Yorkshire Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2019
    Posts:
    63
    App Stage:
    Passed PJFT
    Thoughts on the US air strike that killed the Iranian General? And that Iran has stated they will exact a ‘crushing revenge’

    Could very well be a very interesting turn of events.
     
    • Gen Dit Gen Dit x 1
    • Gucci Info Gucci Info x 1
  8. rkec

    rkec Valuable Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2008
    Posts:
    349
    US issues statement to its citizens to leave Iraq immediately via any route.

    Was this really worth it?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Gen Dit Gen Dit x 1
  9. JWJ

    JWJ Venerated Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    791
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    Soleimani was really the chief puppeteer and figurehead of Iranian Terrorism Export Ltd, he was directly involved in a lot of bad stuff around the middle east. There probably are not too many US Citizens in Iraq, and the travel advisory was published before the strike against the General (due to the violence around the Embassy and other sites).
     
    • Gucci Info Gucci Info x 1
  10. Chelonian

    Chelonian Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Posts:
    9,798
    Yes. Assuming that the strategy underpinning the assassination was to unify faltering support in an election year.

    Iran is the 'go-to' enemy when a distraction from chaotic domestic policy is required.
     
    • Gen Dit Gen Dit x 1
    • Seen Seen x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  11. JWJ

    JWJ Venerated Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    791
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    If it isn't broke..
     
    • Like Like x 1
  12. ThreadpigeonsAlpha

    ThreadpigeonsAlpha Royal Marines Commando

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2015
    Posts:
    4,563
    I’m pretty certain the small print on PAX life insurance stated they won’t pay out if we went to war with France, USA, Russia, Iran or Korea?
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Gen Dit Gen Dit x 1
  13. rkec

    rkec Valuable Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2008
    Posts:
    349
    When you say exported terrorism, do you have examples of where they have exported it? Iran has never struck me as a country that has a history of being involved in terrorism.

    Terrorism being a tough to define word of course.
     
  14. JWJ

    JWJ Venerated Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    791
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    Oh boy, this could be a long one...
    • Hezbollah
    • Hamas
    • Islamic Jihad (PIJ)
    • PFLP-GC
    • Quds Force
    • Iranian Revoluntarity Guards have been involved in dozens of incidents
    Are all confirmed links to Iran and/or direct incidents. Additionally, Iran has been blamed for attacks or plots in the following countries:
    • Argentina
    • Albania
    • Bahrain
    • Denmark
    • France
    • Thailand
    • India
    • Israel
    • Kenya
    • Iraq
    Iran has also been tied to Al-Qaeda and other similar extremist groups, with some pointing the blame at them for enabling Bin Laden et al to develop the know-how to develop into what they did. Additionally, it is accepted that Iran supported and supplied the Taliban in Afghanistan against ISAF forces.

    Iran also heavily backs most if not all the Shi'ite militias and extremist groups in the middle east, especially in Syria and Iraq. To say Iran is not involved in terrorism is to say that Chinese factories are not involved in the counterfeit market. I'm not going to list sources to try to keep this post relatively small, but I can assure anyone if they research the topic they'll find troves of research, studies and reports on the above and much much more.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Seen Seen x 1
  15. News

    News RSS Feed

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2008
    Posts:
    9,356
    Chief international correspondent Lyse Doucet explains the significance of the attack.

    Continue reading...
     
  16. rkec

    rkec Valuable Contributor

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2008
    Posts:
    349
    My apologies, but I don't see a specific example of an incident in there.

    Let me flip this round for you and give you an example of a terrorist act against Iran. That is what I would consider a terrorist incident.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assassination_of_Iranian_nuclear_scientists
     
    • Seen Seen x 1
  17. Chelonian

    Chelonian Moderator

    Joined:
    Aug 10, 2010
    Posts:
    9,798
    Being Devil's advocate here but how is the assassination of Soleimani not an act of terrorism?

    It's probable that UK lawyers are crawling all over the USA's legal justification now in preparation for possible escalation consequences.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. JWJ

    JWJ Venerated Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    791
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    Is what I was responding to, rather than a specific incident but I'll indulge:

    The 1994 AMIA Bombing, which killed 85 Argentinian civilians. Evidence lead to Iran and specifically Hezbollah to be blamed, and a sub-group of Hezbollah claimed responsibility for the attack.

    2012 Bangkok bombings, an attempt to assassinate Isreali diplomats carried out by Iranian nationals.

    July 2012 attempt to kill an Isreali diplomat in India.

    Literally hundreds of Hezbollah attacks. Literally hundreds of Hamas attacks. I really don't want to keep listing things, and if Wikipedia is seemingly an acceptable source here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_and_state-sponsored_terrorism#
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Rover

    Rover Moderator

    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2008
    Posts:
    3,782
    World News

    US killing of Iranian commander on Iraqi soil violates terms of US stationing troops in the country – Iraqi PM

    3 Jan, 2020 08:41 / Updated 1 hour ago

    upload_2020-1-3_11-2-49.jpg <img src="https://cdni.rt.com/files/2020.01/xxs/5e0ef88d2030273f941a9680.JPG" class="media__item " alt="US killing of Iranian commander on Iraqi soil violates terms of US stationing troops in the country – Iraqi PM" />

    FILE PHOTO. An anti-US protest in Iraq. ©REUTERS / Alaa al-Marjani

    The interim prime minister of Iraq has condemned the US assassination of a senior Iranian commander, calling it an act of aggression against his country. Qassem Soleimani was killed at Baghdad airport.

    Soleimani, the commander of the elite Quds Force, was killed after his convoy was hit by US missiles. A deputy commander of the Popular Mobilization Forces (PMF), the Iraqi militia collective backed by Iran, was killed in the same airstrike.

    In a statement on Friday, the caretaker leader of Iraq's protest-challenged government, Adil Abdul Mahdi, said the US assassination operation was a "flagrant violation of Iraqi sovereignty" and an insult to the dignity of his country.

    He stressed that the US had violated the terms under which American troops are allowed to stay in Iraq with the purpose of training Iraqi troops and fighting the jihadist organization Islamic State (IS, formerly ISIS). He added that the killing may trigger a major escalation of violence and result in "a devastating war in Iraq" that will spill out into the region.

    The Iraqi government has called on the parliament to hold an emergency session to discuss an appropriate response, Mahdi said.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  20. JWJ

    JWJ Venerated Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2016
    Posts:
    791
    App Stage:
    Passed PRMC
    I'll try and argue the counter-point here for the sake of argument. The legality of these kinds of strikes comes from Bush's Authorisation for the Use of Military Force Act (AUMF), which at its centre gives the President the authority to "use all necessary and appropriate force against those nations, organizations, or persons he determines planned, authorized, committed, or aided the terrorist attacks that occurred on September 11, 2001, or harbored such organizations or persons, in order to prevent any future acts of international terrorism against the United States by such nations, organizations or persons."

    This is compounded by the definition of the Iranian Revolutionary Guard (IRG) and its sub-groups, as Terrorist organisations. The IRG has been linked to the Al-Qaeda, Taliban and OBL and blamed for those groups gaining the ability to carry out their operations including 9/11. Furthermore, the US has attributed "hundreds" of service personnel's deaths and injury to the actions of the IRG and Soleimani in particular. So we can see the US Govt tries to tie the IRG into the parameters given in the AUMF and continued threat. The strike, if their narrative is to be believed, is that this was a counter-terrorism act, aimed to prevent further terrorist attacks and operations against Americans.

    If this strike was an act of terrorism, then so must have been every other such drone strike. I don't really see any way to try to challenge that view and I wouldn't necessarily disagree with it.
     
    • Seen Seen x 1