what to do about pirates?

mike webb

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we havent had a good discussion on the POC section for a while! seeing as it is a current and continuing problem it might be a good discussion topic for AIB recruits.

So, recently there has been a obvious and very public increase in pirate activity. This morning 19/11/08, a pirate vessel even tried to board an Indian Navy warship, but thankfully were repelled.

Up to this point the rules of engagement regarding pirates are to fire only in defence, such as we saw the other day when 2 somali nationals were killed in a fightfire with the RM's.

However with the spread of piracy and its growing threat, how should the international community react? Should the rules of engagement be changed to allow a more aggressive approach to the problem.. or does the real problem lie in the lawless heartland of somalia. Should an international effort be made to bring a strong goverance to somalia and then use a strong cental government to stamp out piracy of the seas around the country?

mike
 

JDMSAM

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Remember in 93 when the american US RANGERS and DELTA FORCE were camped in Mogadishu and stormed Bakara market in the "First Battle of Somalia" to capture Mohamed Farrah Aidid's militia ended up geting in a fire fight for 24 hours killing over 1000 Somalians and losing Eighteen American soldiers and 73 wounded and 2 blackhawk helo's

You've all seen the movie....

This isnt a new problem in somalia its been like this for years its just now its in the news outside of the country on pirate vessels.

What to do....

obviously past events dictates stepping into this country to "sort out there government" with the history its had will result in another war instead of the east on the african continent.

Its a delicate matter with no real resolve for the imediate future.

A united front from the US NAVY, ROYAL NAVY, NATO, to police the waters to eliminate the pirate threat could be a suggestion...
 

v3locity

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I feel that invading Somalia would just cause more problems like the ones we are currently seeing in Afghanistan, where we are constantly fighting rebels and failing to control the area.

Also we are currently stretched anyway.

Another point to bear in mind is that we are currently in an economical crisis, do we really want to be paying for another war/backing a government of another country when our own country is currently in trouble?

It would be a reasonable idea to police the waters more in them areas, not just us but internationally as it is an international problem.

At the moment i feel that we have to many problems at home to warrant the cost of policing the waters in them areas, and that our best efforts should be concentrated on other things.
 

NDC_OSPREY

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I have to agree with v3locity, it would be simply to expensive to send the forces into Somalia, especially with the real possibility of us sending troops to the Congo at the moment. Increasing the navies presence (ours or anyone else) in the area is the only solution (not much of one though) that we can afford at the moment.
 

a flying dodo

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Maybe a law could be passed saying that for every say 5 men on a ship, there should be one fire arm, and the captian should be allowed to carry one. The guns would be kept under lock and key and the captain with the only key, hence why he has a gun.

This should only be available to those crossing those dangerous areas on route.

However i think the reason for the current rules of engagement are so we dont accidently kill some inoocent people.

Maybe all NATO etc. ships or boats could have tagging devices, so you know who are friendly and not.
 

NDC_OSPREY

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The intentions are good but that would increase piracy in my opinion. Lots of men with boats, all carrying guns sounds like a bad recipe for piracy to me. Imagine you own a small boat of of Iran, or Mozambique or any country brodering the Indian ocean, I bet it would be tempting if you could legally carry guns.
 
S

Sotiris

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I have a personal interest in this matter. My fathers ship was raided, boarded and stripped of all movable parts by pirates in Somalia. His ships were constantly fired upon by small arms and RPG's.

There isn't any way you can distinguish between a pirate and a fisherman. They all carry weapons in that country, so aggressive action towards them is useless. You'd just end up with a lot of collateral.

The problem lies with each ships individual security. Somalian pirates will not risk their lives. If each ship has the ability to protect itself it should make that known asap. That acts as a huge deterrent, and only those individuals who are crazy/stupid enough, or are tripping on alcohol or opium would be foolish enough to try and raid the ship.

All of my dads ships have at least 3 armed guards on board now and each ship sports a HMG on the bow just for show. Since that has been done there hasn't been a single incident so far.
 

j.cunners

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The EU has announced a joint "armada" to patrol the coast of Somalia, the naval operation the first undertaken by the EU, will be under the command of a British Admiral. All the obvious nations are sending vessels Britain, France etc.

Whether this is effective in stopping the frequent and increasingly routine attacks on vessels in the area will be interesting to see, depends I believe on the approach taken by the admiral in charge. Whether he employs offensive or responsive approaches is yet to be seen.
 

JoeSmith

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Can I just ask you all remember that tanker which was held up for ransom, yeah?

Well what happened to it I haven't heard any news since?
 

Adamos

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There has been a NATO assistance in Somalia for a long while now assiting in airlift, not that you asked that.

Recently a new operation allied provider was launched headed by an Italian Admiral (Rear Admiral Giovanni GUMIERO) and its goal is to combat the pirates through presence, recce and actually confronting, but predominantly through ship escort, which must be a challenge because there arent that many naval vessels compared to civvie ships transporting goods...and aid to Somalia which they nick aswell of the AU and EU.
I think the FSRT from FPGRM will be the guys we see doing the boardings.

My opinion of going into Somalia is the same as most, I think it would be incredibly difficult. They have had no secure govnt since 1991 now, and rebels control most of the country. The piracy is a expansion of an existing threat. It has become a suprisingly advanced threat nowadays and needs to be approached sensitively. They have their computer guys (thought to have links with UAE), naval guys and infantryman experienced in their necessary roles. Particuarly the infantry chaps who are experienced in fighting from many, many years.

To go into Somalia, i agree with v3locity, would end up like Ghanners. The people there dont have tv or external communications. They believe what they are brought up to believe. The Americans found out this when they went there and every one of the normal population hated them, because they knew no better. That and the rebels were drugged up and didnt really care about much.
 

calger14

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i think we are doing fairly well taking them on at the moment
 

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